BA - Boeing Company

Discussion in 'Stock Message Boards NYSE, NASDAQ, AMEX' started by Stockaholic, Apr 1, 2016.

  1. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    There is quite a bit of talk of electric fans and fuel cells.

    I am extremely skeptical of this configuration. Fuel cells are clearly superior to batteries for aviation but I will bet on the evolution of the turboprop over electric propulsion for the next generation of commercial travel. Electric commercial aviation is two generations away, at best.

    For the argumentative types, I did not just write that electric aviation is two generations away. There will be plenty of electric aircraft in the air in the next five years. My point is that you won't be getting on an electric aircraft to fly to Hawaii in the next 15 years.

    Aviation is extremely slow to evolve.

    I have no doubt Boeing is working on new airframes and working with next generation propultion, right now. Not for commercial aviation, though.

    Boeing has the advantage of hosting drone development. When we start to see drones with high aspect ratio wings and next generation fan propulsion, we will know a new commercial airliner is just around the corner.

    If new technology can achieve half of what has been promised, airlines will be standing in line to get the new aircraft. Hopefully, Boeing will have purged most of their corrupt management by then.
     
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  2. T0rm3nted

    T0rm3nted Moderator
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    Stellantis has a joint venture with Archer Aviation to make electric air taxis. So electric air travel is definitely being worked on.
     
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  3. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    I wish to ask, as politely and delicately as I am able, what Stellantis brings to the table of electrified flight?


    BTW, there are a lot of electrified aircraft projects. Many of them started years ago.

    In fact, there is a commuter airline that operates 10 flights per day between New York and Washington D.C., transferring thousands of passengers per day. No... I'm just kidding.

    This is another case where 99.999% of people think you can install some batteries and an electric motor in place of an engine nacell and convert a plane to electric propulsion in an hour. As mentioned in my previous post, lots of work being done but nobody is going to be flying from the mainland to Hawaii on an electric plane in the next decade. We will be lucky to achieve that in 15 years.

    Initially, electric aircraft will be dedicated to short haul cargo. It will be quite a while before PAX are being shuttled around in flying hair dryers. It will be far, far longer before PAX are flying over an ocean in an electric plane.

    8 to 10 years after the technology is sufficiently mature to electrify regional travel, never mind long haul.
     
    #123 TomB16, Jan 23, 2023
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2023
  4. T0rm3nted

    T0rm3nted Moderator
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    Question 1: Capital, and far more manufacturing capability than Archer would have without them.

    Question 2: I was only talking about the one I'm most familiar with. Our plant manager is going to help them out in Georgia soon.

    Comment 3: That's exactly what this joint venture is. Short hauls.
     
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  5. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    It seems an odd fit but I find it extremely interesting. If an aircraft startup had easy access to CNC manufacturing, it could cut 90% of their time to first test flight.

    I watched two aircraft startups fail. Both had excellent ideas and were operated by really strong thinkers. In both cases, they bit off more than they could chew in terms of cost and sheer man hours to produce a prototype.

    Whatever the case, I wish both companies well. :thumbsup:

    It's great to see Stellantis branch out beyond automobiles. The car industry has some pretty severe years ahead.

    I just checked out the Archer Aviation web site. That configuration looks extremely similar to something I saw about a decade ago. It was probably an earlier iteration from Archer but I don't recall the specifics.

    The prototype doesn't look real. It looks like a rendering. It's absolutely gorgeous and certainly an interesting design.

    The route he announced at the end of the unveil was NY city to Newark Liberty International Airport. That is really short; far less than 50 miles miles. This is what I would expect from a battery operated aircraft. With fuel cells, they could go substantially further but I expect that will be for a new, second generation, airframe.
     
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  6. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    Boeing has halted delivery of 787 aircraft, in light of a "fuselage issue".
     
  7. Smokie

    Smokie Well-Known Member

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    AEROSPACE & DEFENSE
    Boeing sells 78 Dreamliner planes to Saudi airlines
    CNBC

    Boeing said Tuesday that it has reached a deal to sell 78 of its 787 Dreamliner planes to two Saudi Arabian airlines, the latest large order for the wide-body jets in the past few months.

    The jetliners will go to Saudi Arabian Airlines, or Saudia, and a new airline, called Riyadh Air, which Crown Prince Mohammad bin Salman announced over the weekend. Saudia ordered 39 of the planes, with options for 10 more, and Riyadh Air will get 39 of the two largest models of the planes, with options for 33 more.


    Boeing did not disclose a timeline for deliveries of the planes.

    “This will support the country’s goal of serving 330 million passengers and attracting 100 million visits by 2030,” Riyadh Air said in a news release.

    The sale shows a pickup in demand for wide-body aircraft, planes that are used for long-distance flights and fetch a higher price than the more-common narrow-body jets.

    Riyadh Air is owned by the country’s sovereign wealth fund and will be helmed by Tony Douglas as CEO, a longtime industry veteran and former CEO of Etihad Airways.

    In December, United Airlines agreed to buy at least 100 Dreamliners from Boeing and last month, Air India placed an order for 460 Boeing and Airbus planes.


    Boeing is set to resume deliveries of the Dreamliner planes this week after a weekslong pause resulting from a data analysis issue it disclosed last month.
     
  8. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    Boeing is currently struggling with a 737 Max production slowdown.

    Why does the board tolerate such incompetent and corrupt executive? It's not like we need any more data points on this graph to see what is going on.
     
  9. anotherdevilsadvocate

    anotherdevilsadvocate Well-Known Member

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    #129 anotherdevilsadvocate, Sep 18, 2023
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2023
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  10. StockJock-e

    StockJock-e Brew Master
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    We are here again unfortunately. Conflicts lead to renewed interest in defence stocks.
     
  11. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    How would a trader think about this stock? I wonder how much different a trader would look at this stock as my own view?

    When I look at Boeing, I see a corrupt company in decline. They could use a wholesale management change but that will never happen, under any conditions I can foresee.

    So, if I were to gamble on BA, I would be watching closely for a short term peak and then sell the company short, comfortable in the thought it will come back down over time, as long as war in the middle east does not escalate.

    For me, BA short term (0-2 years) pivots on Gazraeli conflict containment. If it turns into a multi-nation war, BA will go up. If Israel can contain things quickly, BA will go down. I would gamble on containment, were I placing a bet.
     
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  12. StockJock-e

    StockJock-e Brew Master
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    Its been a pretty good Nov for BA
     
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  13. StockJock-e

    StockJock-e Brew Master
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    Good bounce, but downtrend might not be over
     
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  14. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    I have never sold a company short in my life. Boeing might be the first.

    It is possible I might sell calls, instead.

    Boeing is going to transform into something less. I suspect it will be saved from the scrap pile but they will have difficulty delivering the 777X and are unlikely to have any new aircraft programs successfully deliver after that.

    Who knows what will happen after that. A forced merger? US government takes some of the debt and forces sale to... Who? Who could? Its a small list without an ideal for, IMO.

    Part of this is an indictment on western business. Aggressive people have out competed smart people. This problem is not unique to Boeing, to say the least.
     
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  15. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    Boeing to buy back Spirit Aerosystems.

    This move could take out Boeing and Air Bus in one shot. Lol!
     
  16. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    COMAC now has 1200 orders for the C919. This, even after boosting their price to match Boeing.

    That is a lot of orders for an unproven aircraft that is more than 10% less fuel efficient than the B737 Max and has 25% less range.

    If ever there was evidence for a direct rejection of Boeing, as opposed to someone out competing Boeing, this is it. If you have an aircraft that hasn't killed people, you go to the front of the line.

    Several of Boeing's management should be in jail. That is not written as hyperbole. If you create an environment that fires people for pointing out safety issues in aviation , you need to be removed from society.

    Air Bus is a good company (mostly) that seems to be the heir apparent but they do not know how to scale. The real beneficiary of Boeing is going to be COMAC.
     
  17. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    Just so we are on the same page, Boeing is the #1 American exporter.

    While the C919 is significantly off the performance of the B737 Max, it is a gen 1 aircraft that will evolve quickly as China steals more tech from Boeong and it hasn't killed anyone, yet.
     
  18. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure whats going on at Boeing but with two more incidents in two days and they aren't providing documents to the last investigation, seems like we are on for another show.

    To be fair, I strongly suspect one of the two incidents is not Boeing's fault and I don't know about the other. All involve the B737. They should probably provide the NTSB some docs, though. Perhaps it is taking longer to falsify them than anticipated. (OK, that was snarky but enjoyable)

    I predict Dave Calhoun is on the way out. The board would probably prefer he continue running the show until Boeing goes out of business but they may be forced to spin the wheel one more time and let someone else be the pilot of record when Boeing hits the ground.

    Boeing death watch: Tom's prediction is 2032
     
    #138 TomB16, Mar 8, 2024
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2024
  19. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    New NTSB investigation into a stuck rudder pedal on the max.

    Can I revise my prediction?
     
  20. anotherdevilsadvocate

    anotherdevilsadvocate Well-Known Member

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    Sooner or later.
    BA stock price should be MUCH lower based on the abilities of the leadership, so I assume it is because the institutions know that the C-suite guys are going to get the boot. You heard of a stock being priced to perfection? Well BA is priced to the current chief executives getting thrown the fuck out.
    Current executives are trash and never had anything to do with Boeing (they came over from McDonnell Douglas, and somehow took over control of Boeing.)
    When the new guys get put in place, I wonder if they will move headquarters back to Seattle?
     
    #140 anotherdevilsadvocate, Mar 8, 2024
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2024
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