The Long Term Investor

Discussion in 'Investing' started by WXYZ, Oct 2, 2018.

  1. WXYZ

    WXYZ Well-Known Member

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    HEY....does anyone remember that we have STILL been in the middle of earnings this week?

    It has just been....crickets......BIG CRICKETS. No one is talking about them.....even though they have been HISTORIC. Sure there are articles every day on the companies that are reporting....but they are definately an after-thought. No one seems to be focused on earnings. Kind of like the tree falling in the woods with no one there to hear it.....if they report earnings and no one cares or notices, did they really happen?

    HERE is one BIG report today....I dont own it so I will leave it to those that do to click on it.

    Disney Q3 earnings top estimates as Disney+ subscribers grow more than expected

    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/disney-earnings-q3-2021-145909103.html
     
  2. zukodany

    zukodany Well-Known Member

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    Yup Disney is no shock to me… but the market does what the market does… I’m pretty sure that by next week Dis will fall back to what it was this week… I almost regret buying so much of it in the past… if it was a company I didn’t believe in I wouldn’t hold a single share of it but, come on, they own marvel, Pixar, espn, Hulu, they arguably own the biggest quality IP lineup and keep on innovating and expanding. In my mind this should easily be a half trillion market cap but hey what the heck do I know
     
    #7162 zukodany, Aug 12, 2021
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2021
  3. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    This morning, while cleaning up after dropping a sewer pickle, i missed the bowl with a wad of paper. Before I could reach down to pick it up, someone bought it at 10% above market.
     
    #7163 TomB16, Aug 13, 2021
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2021
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  4. duckleberry_fin

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    I tend to agree with you here and I believe there are 2 strong forces causing this:

    First, a large majority of millennials like myself have been raised with the concept of the boots theory of economic unfairness popularized in an early 90s Terry Pratchett Discworld novel. For those that haven't heard it, the premise is that the wealthy stay wealthy because over the long term they can afford to spend less money on necessary goods - boots being the example. A wealthy man can afford a $100 air of boots that last 1 year while a poor man can afford a $50 pair of boots that last 1/3 of a year. Over time, the wealthy man will spend less on boots. It's such an easy concept to teach and learn that I had first heard it in elementary school, long before I read a single Terry Pratchett book. I've had discussions about this "theory" in pretty much every stage of education since 7th/8th grade.

    Second, other than essentially 1 year over a decade ago, millennials have enjoyed one of the most incredible markets in history. I started investing in 2011. While I understand what a bear market is, I've certainly never truly experienced one. I think my experience is probably very common among millennials and from personal experience I know it's difficult to not get caught up when all you've ever experienced is "winning".

    When you combine the above 2 forces, it is incredibly easy to tell yourself - at least from the millennial perspective - "I should be spending my money on luxury goods because I'll save in the long run (AND have nice things now), and I should be investing in the market with my remaining dollars because seemingly any bozo can make money in this climate."
     
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  5. zukodany

    zukodany Well-Known Member

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    Following PLTR closely today is like watching a James Bond classic.
    Sold a few junk positions in my short term portfolio to fund a purchase in the event it hits my threshold buy mark
     
  6. WXYZ

    WXYZ Well-Known Member

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    I agree with your observations duckleberry.

    It will be very interesting to watch ALL the investors that have come on board since 2009 and have ONLY invested during the greatest BULL MARKET in history.......discounting the short term hit from the pandemic. A real BEAR MARKET is a definite experience. It will normally involve at least 1-3 years of time.......with many periods during the course of the BEAR when stocks might experience BEAR MARKET rallies. It can be very confusing and very disheartening.
     
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  7. WXYZ

    WXYZ Well-Known Member

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    I am off to a good start today. Seven of ten positions are green and I am starting with a moderate gain. My 3 losers are HOME DEPOT -0.63%, APPLE -0.07%, and AMAZON -0.27%. My BEST holdings today are NVIDIA at +1.11% and MICROSOFT at +0.66%.

    I dont see any out of the ordinary news going on today.....so the market will just have to find its own way to end the week.
     
  8. WXYZ

    WXYZ Well-Known Member

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    I am actually HAPPY to see these consumer numbers.

    U.S. consumer sentiment plummets in early August to decade low

    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/u-consumer-sentiment-plummets-early-142604920.html

    (BOLD is my opinion OR what I consider important content)

    "Reuters) -U.S. consumer sentiment dropped sharply in early August to its lowest level in a decade, in a worrying sign for the economy as Americans gave faltering outlooks on everything from personal finances to inflation and employment, a survey showed on Friday.

    The unexpected reading could give Federal Reserve policymakers pause if it translates in the months ahead to a dent in economic activity. The central bank has been getting closer to a decision on when to begin pulling back the extraordinary stimulus it put in place to shield the economy from the COVID-19 pandemic.

    The University of Michigan said its preliminary consumer sentiment index fell to 70.2 in the first half of this month from a final reading of 81.2 in July. That was the lowest level since 2011, and there have been only two larger declines in the index over the past 50 years. Those were at the depths of the 2007-2009 recession and during the first wave of shutdowns in April 2020 at the beginning of the pandemic.

    The losses were widespread across income, age, and education subgroups and spanned all regions. Economists polled by Reuters had forecast the index would remain unchanged at 81.2.

    U.S. stock market indexes slipped immediately after the report was released, while the price of gold gained ground. U.S. Treasury bond yields hit session lows.

    "The renewed plunge suggests the latest wave of virus cases driven by the Delta variant could be a bigger drag on the economy than we had thought," said Andrew Hunter, an economist at Capital Economics.

    Economic growth is still expected to grow this year at its fastest pace in four decades after falling into a brief recession in 2020 caused by the coronavirus pandemic. But the recovery is showing some indication of cooling off.

    COVID-19 cases have doubled in the past two weeks to reach a six-month peak as the more transmissible Delta variant spreads rapidly across the country. Labor shortages across the service sector also persist while supply chain disruptions have continued.

    "The pandemic's resurgence due to the Delta variant has been met with a mixture of reason and emotion...mainly from dashed hopes that the pandemic would soon end," Richard Curtin, the survey director, said in a statement.

    The survey's gauge of current economic conditions also declined to a reading of 77.9 from 84.5 in July while its measure of consumer expectations slid to 65.2 from 79.0 in July.

    The survey also showed consumers raising their expectations for medium term inflation, another measure the central bank is closely monitoring to ensure that inflation expectations remain anchored.

    The survey's one-year inflation expectation edged lower to 4.6%, down from 4.7%, but its five-year inflation outlook ticked up to 3.0% from 2.8% in July.

    Consumer price increases slowed in July, the Labor Department said on Wednesday, but inflation overall remained at a historically high level amid lingering supply-chain disruptions and stronger demand for travel-related services."

    MY COMMENT

    FINE with me. I do not want to see EUPHORIA. I prefer a FEAR based environment to prolong the inaction of the FED and to keep the historic stock rally going for.....perhaps....years.

    I dont believe these numbers mean much anyway. I remember these sorts of polls back in the 1980's. They were NOT valid......because......back than if you asked people how they felt about the economy they were negative in general. BUT....if you asked them about "THEIR" specific situation....they were positive. I think these current number are likely the same situation.

    I would much rather see strong growth over a longer time span than CRAZY EXPLOSIVE growth over a shorter time span. OBVIOUSLY....we are just at the START of the re-opening......in spite of the fact that for ome reason the media and others....seem to want to see everything just UNREALISTICALLY jump back open immediately. It is going to be a long process......12-24 months......of re-opening in fits and starts and spurts.

    Supply chain and supply/demand issues are going to be the norm for 12-24 months.
     
    #7168 WXYZ, Aug 13, 2021
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2021
  9. WXYZ

    WXYZ Well-Known Member

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    As to INFLATION.......yes TRANSITORY inflation....here is the perfect example.

    Half of Lumber Dealers Now Sit on Excess Inventory in the U.S.

    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/half-lumber-dealers-now-sit-202239107.html

    (BOLD is my opinion OR what I consider important content)

    "(Bloomberg) -- Almost half of U.S. lumber dealers and manufacturers reported excess inventories last month, a sharp turnround from a few months ago, when supplies ran so low they sparked price surges.

    In July, 49% of building-material dealers and manufacturers said they had excess lumber capacity, while none described their levels as “very tight,” in a survey by John Burns Real Estate Consulting LLC. Back in April, 40% said their wood inventories were “very tight.”

    Lumber prices have come down from records in May, when sawmills were caught off guard with low inventories amid a surge in home building and renovation. Producers have since increased output, and a shortage of other building supplies such as siding and windows has slowed the pace of construction.

    In the John Burns Real Estate Consulting survey, about 34% of the respondents said they had slightly low or very tight inventories in July.

    Lumber futures are now 70% below their peak and trading at about $500 per thousand board feet."

    MY COMMENT

    This is just how it is going to work as the re-opening spreads across the economy product by product, business by business. This is RATIONAL and LOGICAL. Everyone is in a big hurry for instant results. It is just NOT going to happen. You can not shut down the entire economy and than expect it all to MAGICALLY pop back to normal. It will make a big difference when the FREE money ends and people have to.....once again....pay their rent and student loans and mortgages. We need to get production, shipping, manufacturing, raw materials, etc, etc,......back to normal. It just TAKES TIME.
     
  10. WXYZ

    WXYZ Well-Known Member

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    As to the markets today...this is where we start on a short term basis for the day.

    Stock market news live updates: S&P 500, Dow set intraday records amid strong earnings, economic data

    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/stock-market-news-live-updates-august-13-2021-225028298.html

    (BOLD is my opinion OR what I consider important content)

    "Stocks gained on Friday, reaching fresh record intraday levels as investors digested a largely solid set of recent economic data and earnings results.

    The S&P 500 and Dow set intraday highs, building on record levels from Thursday. Both indexes have continued to make new highs as optimism over both the pace of the economic recovery and strength in corporate earnings results lingered.

    Disney (DIS) shares jumped after the Dow component posted both revenue and earnings that topped expectations for its latest quarter, with growth at its closely watched Disney+ streaming platform holding up more robustly than anticipated. Airbnb (ABNB) shares fell, however, after the home rental company forecasted a drop in current-quarter bookings as the Delta variant weighs on travel. DoorDash (DASH) shares also fell, even after the company posted second-quarter sales and earnings that topped estimates as food delivery held up in the quarter.

    For the broader economy, the data have been trending higher, albeit with some bumps along the way. Thursday's weekly report on new jobless claims showed a third straight weekly drop in new filings, albeit at a level still elevated compared to 2019 trends. And while Wednesday's inflation report on consumer prices was in-line with estimates, Thursday's print on producer prices exceeded estimates. The 7.8% increase in the producer price index on a year-over-year basis was the highest on record, in Labor Department data spanning back more than a decade.

    "I think the current inflation prints we're seeing ... reflect mostly transitory things, and they would calm down on their own. But I do think that once those pandemic-specific effects have passed through, there is going to be some inflation that is above the Fed's comfort zone," Tom Graff, Brown Advisory head of fixed income, told Yahoo Finance. "I think they're going to be able to take control of it, I think they'll start tapering QE in [the fourth quarter] and probably wind up hiking late in 2022 or early in 2023. And then the question just becomes, how many hikes does it take? How high do interest rates need to go to get inflation back under control."

    Meanwhile, a string of record closing highs for the major equity market indexes has left traders to ponder what might emerge as a catalyst to knock stocks off their upward trajectory. The S&P 500 has not seen a 5% pullback since October of last year, and is up nearly 19% so far for the year-to-date.

    Still, some strategists suggested the path of least resistance remains up and to the right for stocks.

    "Under the hood, so many companies have had a 10%, 14%, 15% retrenchment from peak to trough. So I’m not as concerned that the markets have been trending higher because there’s a few big names that hold it up," Kevin Simpson, Capital Wealth Planning founder and CEO, told Yahoo Finance. "There are so many companies that had pullbacks of magnitudes that we would consider correction territory."

    "We're seeing markets show incredible resilience, and they continue to make new highs," he added. "I would expect some volatility – I don't know what the catalyst is. The Delta variant is the one staring us in the face as certainly the most obvious. And if we see a 10% pullback, which I'm not expecting, I would jump in and buy it with both feet."

    10:07 a.m. ET: Consumer sentiment unexpectedly tumbled in August as individuals reported a 'stunning loss of confidence' amid Delta variant: U. Michigan
    The University of Michigan's closely watched Surveys of Consumers reflected a sharp drop in confidence in early August, with concerns over the pace of the economic recovery coming into question as the Delta variant spread.

    The University of Michigan's headline sentiment index slumped to 70.2 in August from 81.2 in July, according to the preliminary monthly print. The level was only slightly below the April 2020 low of 71.8.

    "Consumers reported a stunning loss of confidence in the first half of August," Richard Curtin, chief economist for the Surveys of Consumers, said in a press statement. "There is little doubt that the pandemic's resurgence due to the Delta variant has been met with a mixture of reason and emotion. Consumers have correctly reasoned that the economy's performance will be diminished over the next several months, but the extraordinary surge in negative economic assessments also reflects an emotional response, mainly from dashed hopes that the pandemic would soon end."

    " In the months ahead, it is likely that consumers will again voice more reasonable expectations, and with control of the Delta variant, shift toward outright optimism," he added.

    10:03 a.m. ET: 'It's unlikely that we're going to see tech outperformance near-term': Strategist
    The continued moves to fresh all-time highs in the broader market belies an ongoing tug-of-war between cyclical and growth stocks under the surface, as investors weigh the lingering virus-related risks to the economy with signs that activity has picked up strongly.

    "Our view is the recent rotation back into tech has gone too far, and we think it's unlikely that we're going to see tech outperformance near-term," Keith Lerner, chief market strategist at Truist Wealth, told Yahoo Finance. "The move up we've seen in tech, or the outperformance since May, was really sentiment-driven. Meaning, valuations expanded, but earnings compared to the broader market have actually been weaker as a whole."

    "That doesn't mean there's not some select opportunities," he added. "But we like other areas such as financials and some of the economically sensitive areas that have actually underperformed in the last few months."

    8:58 a.m. ET: Import price growth decelerated in July
    Prices for U.S. imports increased at a slower than expected rate in July, signaling that supply chain constraints may have begun to ease as the economic recovery continued.

    Import prices rose 0.3% in July compared to June, Commerce Department data showed on Friday. This was well below the 0.6% rise expected, and slowed notably from June's 1.0% monthly increase. Still, import prices were up 10.2% compared to the same month last year, and they have increased on a monthly basis for nine consecutive months.

    Much of the increase in overall prices came from energy-related imports, with energy prices rebounding as consumer mobility picked up and demand increased. Excluding petroleum, import prices were up by an even more tepid 0.1%, following a 0.7% rise in June."

    MY COMMENT

    YES.....we continue to ....LURCH....forward. I have no doubt that the direction for stocks is.....UP. I also believe the same for the general economy.

    The GREATEST RISK.....action by government. They need to sit down, shut up, and get out of the way. In other Words let the economy sort ITSELF out over the next year or two. Of course....this is impossible for them to do.....so....they will take various actions that they think are going to help. AND....as usual....it is likely that any action taken will have a NEGATIVE impact in hindsight....as usual.

    Personally.....I think CHINA is also SCREWING WITH our economy and has been for a while now. We continue to be BLIND to what they are doing to us and our economy. NOTHING they do is random....it is all coordinated and calculated.

    As a stock investor.....my focus is on....."me, me, me,"......so as long as "I" am doing fine that is all I have any control over. SO....

    I continue to be fully invested for the long term as usual.
     
  11. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    I share the bear market sentiment.

    We had a couple of people on StockTwits suggesting the fed should step in to bolster the market, after two down days in a row.

    How is that person going to feel after a 1000 day period in which 50 days have a tiny gain and the rest are flat or down?

    Attention spans have gotten shorter, making the problem worse but I wonder if short attention spans will reduce the duration of the bear market, as well.

    Either way, almost everyone who claims to be patient will end up falling from the tree. Those who can do nothing for years will be rewarded handsomely.
     
  12. TomB16

    TomB16 Well-Known Member

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    Meanwhile, the younger generations seem to think stop-loss orders are a good idea while old guys like me keep long term, limit orders open continuously so we can snatch shares away from traders if a flash crash occurs again. A lot of wealth could change hands in a very short time under the right market conditions.
     
  13. emmett kelly

    emmett kelly Well-Known Member

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    speaking of younger generation, of which i am still one to millions, maybe even billions, but probably not.

    Top 20 Trending Stocks On WallStreetBets As Of Friday, Aug. 13, 2021 (Via Swaggy Stocks)
    9:36 am ET August 13, 2021 (Benzinga) Print

    Data from https://swaggystocks.com/dashboard/wallstreetbets/ticker-sentiment

    • ContextLogic (WISH)
    • SoFi Technologies (SOFI)
    • Walt Disney (DIS)
    • Clover Health Investments (CLOV)
    • Palantir Technologies (PLTR)
    • Tesla (TSLA)
    • Rocket Companies (RKT)
    • Micron Technology (MU)
    • Apple (AAPL)
    • Microvast (MVST)
    • Robinhood Markets (HOOD)
    • Moderna (MRNA)
    • AMC Entertainment (AMC)
    • Airbnb (ABNB)
    • eBay (EBAY)
    • Amazon (AMZN)
    • Coinbase Global (COIN)
    • GameStop (GME)
    • Invesco QQQ Trust, Series 1 (QQQ)
    • Virgin Galactic (SPCE)
    © 2021 Benzinga.com. Benzinga does not provide investment advice. All rights reserved.
     

    Attached Files:

    #7173 emmett kelly, Aug 13, 2021
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2021
  14. WXYZ

    WXYZ Well-Known Member

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    There are some nice names in that list Emmett. BUT....the key with the young message board traders....is....even if the buy nice companies...how long are they going to own them.

    You are so right TomB16. The vast majority of investors WILL be shaken out of the markets when we have a REAL BEAR MARKET. That is one of the classic indications in any bear market.......the capitulation that you see with people giving up in waves along the way........with even the strongest finally giving in toward the end and selling out.

    I thiink you may be right about the idea that perhaps we will not see many of the old fashioned bear markets with all the short term focus and short term trading we see now. I am trying to think when the last time we had a good old fashioned bear market....other than the artificial bear market of the pandemic.....I guess the last one we had was 2008/2009. Here is some data I found:

    A Brief History of U.S. Bear Markets

    https://www.investopedia.com/a-history-of-bear-markets-4582652

    (BOLD is mine)

    "On March 11, 2020, the Dow Jones Industrial Average (DJIA) entered a bear market for the first time in 11 years, falling from all-time highs—approaching 30,000—to under 19,000 in just a few short weeks, amid the economic impacts of the global coronavirus (Covid-19) pandemic.

    The next day, March 12, 2020, the S&P 500 and the Nasdaq followed suit. Throughout 2020 and into 2021, however, markets rebounded as optimism about vaccines and a global economic recovery took hold. Still, as the COVID-19 case shows, bear markets can materialize, even amidst an otherwise healthy economy.

    Key Takeaways
    • Bear markets are defined as sustained periods of downward trending stock prices, often triggered by a 20% decline from near-term highs.
    • Bear markets are often accompanied by an economic recession and high unemployment, but bear markets can also be great buying opportunities while prices are depressed.
    • Some of the biggest bear markets in the past century include those that coincided with the Great Depression and Great Recession.
    • The bear market that began on March 11, 2020, was brought on by many factors including the spread of the COVID-19 pandemic.
    When the Bear Comes
    One definition of a bear market says markets are in bear territory when stocks, on average, fall at least 20% off their high. But 20% is an arbitrary number—just as a 10% decline is an arbitrary benchmark for a correction.

    Another definition of a bear market is when investors are more risk-averse than risk-seeking. This kind of bear market can last for months or years, as investors shun speculation in favor of boring, sure bets.

    Several leading stock market indexes around the globe endured bear market declines in 2018. In the U.S., in December 2018, the small-cap Russell 2000 Index (RUT) bottomed out 27.2% below its prior high. The widely-followed U.S. large-cap barometer, the S&P 500 Index (SPX), just missed entering bear market territory, halting its decline 19.8% below its high.

    Similarly, oil prices were in a bear market from May 2014 to February 2016. During this period, oil prices fell continually and unevenly until they reached a bottom.

    Bear markets can happen in sectors and in the broadest markets. The longest time horizon for investors is usually the time between now and whenever they will need to liquidate their investments (for example, during retirement), and over the longest-possible term, bull markets have gone higher and lasted longer than bear markets.

    Bears of All Shapes and Sizes
    Bear markets have come in all shapes and sizes, showing significant variation in depth and duration.

    The bear market that started in March of 2020 began due to a number of factors, including shrinking corporate profits and, possibly, the sheer length of the 11-year bull market that preceded it. The immediate cause of the bear market was a combination of persistent worries about the effect of the COVID-19 pandemic on the world economy and an unfortunate price war in oil markets between Saudi Arabia and Russia that sent oil prices plunging to levels not seen since the bursting of the dotcom bubble in 2000, September 11, 2001, and the second Gulf War.

    Between 1926 and 2017, there have been eight bear markets, ranging in length from six months to 2.8 years, and in severity from an 83.4% drop in the S&P 500 to a decline of 21.8%, according to an analysis by First Trust Advisors based on data from Morningstar Inc. The correlation between these bear markets and recessions is imperfect.

    This chart from Invesco traces the history of bull and bear markets and the performance of the S&P 500 during those periods.

    [​IMG]
    courtesy Invesco.
    At the end of 2019, analysts suspected a bear market might be coming, but they were divided on its duration and severity. For example, Stephen Suttmeier, the chief equity technical strategist at Bank of America Merrill Lynch, said he believed there would be a "garden-variety bear market" that would last only six months, and not go much beyond a 20% dip. At the other end of the spectrum, hedge fund manager and market analyst John Hussman predicted a cataclysmic 60% rout.

    Bear Markets Without Recessions
    Three of the eight bear markets listed above were not accompanied by economic recessions, according to FirstTrust. These included brief, six-month pullbacks in the S&P 500 of 21.8% in the late 1940s and 22.3% in the early 1960s. The stock market crash of 1987 is the most recent example, which was a 29.6% drop lasting only three months, according to First Trust.

    Concerns about excessive equity valuations, with selling pressures exacerbated by computerized program trading, are widely recognized as the trigger for that brief bear market.

    Bear Markets Before Recessions
    In three other bear markets, the stock market decline began before a recession officially got underway. The dotcom crash of 2000 to 2002 also was spurred by a loss of investor confidence in stock valuations that had reached new historic highs.


    The S&P 500 tumbled by 44.7% over the course of 2.1 years, punctuated by a brief recession in the middle
    . Stock market declines of 29.3% in the late 1960s and 42.6% in the early 1970s, lasting 1.6 years and 1.8 years, respectively, also began ahead of recessions and ended shortly before those economic contractions bottomed out.

    Some of the Nastiest Bear Markets (So Far)
    The two worst bear markets of this era were roughly in sync with recessions. The Stock Market Crash of 1929 was the central event in a grinding bear market that lasted 2.8 years and sliced 83.4% off the value of the S&P 500.

    Rampant speculation had created a valuation bubble—and the onset of the Great Depression, itself caused partly by the Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act and partly by the Federal Reserve's decision to rein in speculation with a restrictive monetary policy—only worsened the stock market sell-off.

    The bear market from 2007 to 2009 lasted 1.3 years and sent the S&P 500 down by 50.9%. The U.S. economy had slipped into a recession in 2007, accompanied by a growing crisis in subprime mortgages, with increasing numbers of borrowers unable to meet their obligations as scheduled. This eventually snowballed into a general financial crisis by September 2008, with systemically important financial institutions (SIFIs) across the globe in danger of insolvency.

    Complete collapses in the global financial system and the global economy were averted in 2008 by unprecedented interventions by central banks around the world. Their massive injections of liquidity into the financial system, through a process called quantitative easing (QE), propped up the world economy and the prices of financial assets such as stocks by pushing interest rates down to record low levels.

    The Bottom Line
    The most recent bear market was the result of a global health crisis compounded by fear, which initially triggered a wave of layoffs, corporate shutdowns, and financial disruptions. But markets recovered—as they always have over time. The methods for measuring the length and magnitude of bull and bear markets alike differ among analysts. According to criteria employed by Yardeni Research, for example, there have been 20 bear markets since 1928. The most recent bear market will almost certainly not be the last.""

    MY COMMENT

    I remember very well the 2007/2009 bear market. I was actively posting on another board as usual. There were people that took anywhere from 1-5 years to begin investing in stocks again after it was over. AND....I am sure there were some that NEVER went back to stock investing.
     
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  15. WXYZ

    WXYZ Well-Known Member

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    I like this FUN little article....although I know it is so TRUE.......men actually are AFRAID of their wives.

    The Robinhood Bros Who Keep Their Stock Losses Secret From Their Wives
    What could possibly go wrong?

    https://melmagazine.com/en-us/story/gamestop-robinhood-lies-money-love

    (BOLD is my opinion OR what I consider important content)

    "On more than one occasion in the last few months, Austin, a 34-year-old in Chicago, has frantically tucked his phone away when he heard his wife entering the room. It’s not that he was laying on the couch casually browsing OnlyFans, though. Austin just didn’t want his wife to see him carefully studying the red, jagged lines cascading down his Robinhood account.

    I don’t really know why I haven’t told her,” he admits. “I guess it felt sort of trivial at first, and now I’ve invested $1,500 and feel the window has closed on that discussion.”

    [​IMG]
    Screenshot of Austin’s portfolio
    On r/WallStreetBets, where the GameStop-mania began, you’ll see a similar trend — one that includes many men in much more dire situations than Austin. Driven by the stock-market craze earlier this year, there are a number of men who gambled their entire family’s savings on single stocks without ever telling their significant other.

    The subreddit is, in general, known for its overarching tone of 4chan-esque hypermasculinity. And one common theme in their discussions is how their stock-trading mania makes them undeserving of their (real or imaginary) wives. To that end, posters commonly refer to their successes and failures by debating how their “wife’s boyfriend” will react — a meme with roots in 4Chan-esque emasculating self-deprecation.

    The reality of the situation, however, is much more sinister. In response to a post titled, “I Didn’t Tell the Wife I Used the Equity from the Home We Just Sold,” a member of r/WallStreetBets writes, “I know I feel terrible . But it’s either that or a life in debt, slave waging for the rest of my life. I really really like the stock. I promised to tell her as soon as I made some real gains so that she can be part of it.”

    In the same forum, another redditor posted an apparent loss of over $16,000 after buying GameStop stock while admitting, “I’m an idiot. Wife doesn’t know yet.” He hasn’t posted since, but given that the price of GameStop’s stock remains well below his average price of $260-per-share at the time, it’s unlikely he’s made that money back.

    In the comments of posts like this, there’s never any shortage of other men admitting to investing their family’s money into the stock market without telling their wives:

    [​IMG]

    Moreover, as apps like Robinhood, which make investing in stocks and cryptocurrency easy and accessible for amateur traders, continue to rise in popularity, so too will the number of people taking a chance at striking it rich without telling their significant other. Such a rise in secretive, risky financial behavior worries California-based psychotherapist Thomas Faupl, who specializes in helping couples navigate financial issues. “If you’re taking money out of a joint account and spending it on stocks or cryptocurrency, your partner better know about it,” Faupl explains. “Because if they don’t, that’s financial infidelity. You’re basically cheating.”

    However, all couples share different agreements around their finances. So if a couple has established ground rules wherein each partner gets a discretionary fund to spend as they wish, no-questions-asked, “then one partner is free to spend that money on Robinhood as they wish,” Faupl says.

    “If he keeps it in check, invests small amounts of money in structured amounts of time then it might not be that big a deal,” he continues. “But if he’s pouring more and more money in, and getting a rush from doing so, the question becomes whether he has bad judgment or compulsive behavior, because that can spiral out-of-control.”

    While Austin’s $1,500 hardly rivals the potentially debilitating sums of money lost by other redditors, it’s the compulsivity of Austin’s investments, in addition to the lack of transparency, that Faupl says is worrisome. What initially started for Austin as “throwing $150” into a few stocks he read about on Reddit, now looks like hours spent scouring Reddit and YouTube, gathering information and tips about promising stocks and investment strategies.

    Austin says he doesn’t plan on putting more money in the market, but so far his willpower hasn’t proven very effective. “When I first started, I really didn’t know anything about trading stocks,” he explains. A graphic designer by trade, Austin often found himself frantically googling terms like “limit order,” “calls” and “earnings reports,” as he dumped additional installments of $100 to $250 into his account.

    He maintains that being $300 in the hole wouldn’t necessarily hurt his or his wife’s overall wellbeing, but he admits the full amount of money he’s spent is harder to swallow. “It’s my own account, but we both kinda split up bills and rent and other expenses while the shared account is more of a shared savings account,” he explains. “So on one hand, it’s my money and we’re not super strict with each other’s spending habits. But at the same time, we’re not strict because we’ve established a certain level of trust with each other’s spending habits — like that neither of us would blow money on unnecessary or expensive things.”

    While Austin’s wife likely won’t be happy to learn that he threw $1,500 into cheap penny stocks he knows next to nothing about, Faupl says it’s not the financial loss itself that could cause lasting damage to his marriage. “The behavior raises questions as to what his relationship and priorities are with money, why he’s trying to get rich quick and whether that level of risk tolerance is going to lead to instability down the road,” he tells me.

    To be sure, unless the companies Austin blindly invested in seven months ago turn their stock price around, he’s on a path to losing a lot more money. Worse yet, in the same way gamblers throw more and more money onto the roulette table until they get a win, apps like Robinhood make it very easy for retail investors to keep depositing money, hoping one of their penny stocks will explode in value. More often than not, though, that doesn’t happen. “This becomes a real sticky situation,” Faupl says, because the more money someone loses, the more shame they feel, often causing them to drift further into secrecy.

    The redditors who admit to losing devastating amounts of money without telling their wives often claim they’re only being secretive in order to “surprise” their wife when they ultimately hit it big. “Maybe they would if they did make a ton of money, but I don’t think that’s the motivation for why they’re doing it,” Faupl explains. “They’re caught in the throw of it for themselves, and they’re trying to explain or justify their behavior.”

    Just as couple’s have emotional intimacy and sexual intimacy, Faupl adds that “financial intimacy” in a relationship is equally important. “I’m all for transparency,” he says. “People in a relationship should know each other’s credit reports, each other’s debt load, their savings accounts. That way there’s no surprises, because surprises lead to feelings of betrayal and blowups, and then you’re in couple’s counseling.”

    Roughly 24 hours after Austin first spoke with me for this story, he had gone from deciding to not tell his wife “until the stocks rise and I break even,” to admitting, “Fuck, I should probably just tell her, huh?”

    I feel embarrassed, I really have no excuse for keeping it secret,” he tells me. “I got swept up in something I know nothing about and it’s out of character for me. I don’t think she’ll be mad, but she’ll be hurt.”

    “It’s not that we’re broke, but we’re not exactly rich either — we’ve both got student debt and still rent a tiny apartment,” Austin continues. “So potentially blowing $1,500 on stupid stocks I learned about on Reddit is a breach of trust that I feel pretty bad about. And I’d feel the same way if I found out she’d done something similar.”

    MY COMMENT

    YES......all men are afraid of their wives.

    The young guys.....they have not been PUNISHED enough to have it BEAT INTO THEM to just fess up right away and be done with it. After all....you are a male....just justify it by the age old excuse that men are DUMB.

    MOST older men...that are still married....learned long ago that the best way to avoid the.....maximum pain.....is to just FESS UP immediately. If you are lucky....you might even be able to get some sympathy for being so stupid......."how can I be so stupid.....the only smart thing I have ever done is marry you" (while hitting yourself in the head with an anguished look on your face)......or....if you are really skilled you might be able to.......somehow.......end up by putting the guilt on her. For example....."I was trying to get enough money for that anniversary present you always wanted.....I feel so stupid".

    With some of the recent research on brain development.....If you have a very logical wife....you might be able to claim that your brain is not developed till about age 27.....so....you are really a VICTIM. Once again a play for sympathy.....that will USUALLY not work.

    The BEST COURSE is to let her be fully involved in all the investing decisions so that you....CAN BLAME HER....when it all goes into the toilet.
     
    #7175 WXYZ, Aug 13, 2021
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2021
    Jwalker likes this.
  16. WXYZ

    WXYZ Well-Known Member

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    Another SAD tale of woe by a speculator.....of course it was a MALE.

    How Millennial Investors Lost
    Millions on Bill Ackman’s SPAC


    https://www.institutionalinvestor.c...Investors-Lost-Millions-on-Bill-Ackman-s-SPAC

    "On June 13, a Reddit user calling himself Krurd posted a warning on the social media site: “Don’t buy calls on pre-DA SPACs.”

    Krurd, as it turns out, is a 35-year-old unmarried Chicago psychiatrist who had invested, and subsequently lost, nearly $1 million — all of his savings — in call options on Bill Ackman’s special-purpose acquisition company, Pershing Square Tontine Holdings, before it found a merger partner and inked a definitive agreement, or DA.

    SPACs are simply publicly traded boxes of cash — blank-check companies — that exist to take a private company public via merger. Until that time, however, investors in a SPAC have no clue what they are buying. That hasn’t stopped them from rushing in.

    “Just because I have specialized training doesn’t mean I can’t be just as much of a fool as the guy next door,” the psychiatrist lamented to Institutional Investor in an hour-long phone conversation in July.""..............

    MY COMMENT

    I will leave it to you to read the rest of the article......a very sad story. The only SILVER LINING is that the guy was NOT married.

    I find it interesting that this guy.....speculating away over $1MILLION is a.....PSYCHIATRIST......a medical doctor that treats and deals with behavior issues and mental disorders.
     
  17. WXYZ

    WXYZ Well-Known Member

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    A nice little gain for me to end the week today...... medium GREEN. Plus a nice beat on the old SP500 by 0.18%.
     
  18. WXYZ

    WXYZ Well-Known Member

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    YEA......another week in the can. I ACTUALLY made forward progress this week....ending with another all time personal high.

    HERE is how the markets did.....actually a pretty good week considering the first three days.

    DOW year to date +16.04%
    DOW for the week +0.87%

    SP500 year to date +18.95%
    SP500 for the week +0.71%

    NASDAQ 100 year to date +17.45%
    NASDAQ 100 for the week +0.18%

    NASDAQ year to date +15.01%
    NASDAQ for the week (-0.09%)

    RUSSELL year to date +12.57%
    RUSSELL for the week (-1.10%)
     
  19. WXYZ

    WXYZ Well-Known Member

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    Well I am off to a show tonight. A little road trip of about 100 miles each way. SO.....I am done with the investing talk for the day. I live....... to fight again next week.

    CARRY ON.......and....MAY THE FORCE BE WITH YOU.
     
  20. zukodany

    zukodany Well-Known Member

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    defintely nice list.. I kinda hate that some of the stocks I’m following now (which I BOTH own) are there, eBay & pltr. PLTR is simply a time ticking bomb now… they’re first profitable quarter totally brought them back to the game, I’m waiting to see if they’re gonna break 27 and then I’m YOLOing the shit out of it (you see Emmett I follow the squiggly lines sometimes as well), eBay I just think is an all around great company to own, and I made a promise I’d buy more if they kept with the trends and clearly they did.
    So likely will be an interesting week for me next week to watch.
    up another .15 points today, so I guess my prediction of having a red week this week was off even tho I’m not complaining.
    Enjoy your weekend folks!
     

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